Is it really so worrying, VA's going proprietary? I should think this was forseeable. VA as all the other Linux- Companies was an OpenSource business and while it worked it worked. I have been waiting for these things to happen, the hype is over and so are the opportunities that went with it. A while ago Bruce Perens said it was time to talk about free software again. Maybe its truely time now. We might see VA's fall as a victory for free software over OpenSource, for free software is here to stay long after OS has gone. Maybe now it's time to start promoting fs-ideals among programmers. And maybe now it's also time to look at proper fs-companies like Alessandro Rubini's in Italy (see http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/software-libre- commercial.viability.html). I think we should see the positive side of this. fs was never about business in the first place; OS is. Greet Joachim "I hear that if you play the Windows 2000 CD backwards, you get a satanic message!" -- "That's nothing. If you play it forward, it installs Windows 2000!"